Interview with Martin Garner
Lyndsey Carr has known controversy. She has known what she wanted in life but often didn’t know how to get there. She knows what it is like to be misunderstood and feel judged by people who didn’t know. In 2008 Lyndsey’s partner David Cohen and his brother Ashley were convicted of the murder of Pitsmoor taxi Driver Younis Khan. The news made local and national headlines. The Sheffield Star described David as the head of the UTP gang in Upperthorpe where it said he was ‘ruling the streets with a reign of terror’. The Daily Mirror described them as “Two brothers who orchestrated the gangland execution of an innocent cab driver”.
The Sheffield Star with front page news of David and Ashley’s conviction
This is Lyndsey’s story and her chance to say:
Who am I … really?
I already had some connection with the family through work in the local community and though the local primary school where my wife has taught their two sons. After David’s conviction I visited their house to find a very warm welcome and a keen desire for me to visit David in prison and get to know the family more. Over the last 2 years as I found out more about them, I have found a gap between the banner headlines and people who are looking for a better life, a different life. People in some ways through their own wrong choices, but also as stuff has happened to them have ended up looking for a new beginning, a new start. People who were wondering about God and how life could be different. In some ways people just like me… and you.
Lyndsey – just a few questions so we can find out a bit more about you.
Who were you closest to when you were young?
My mum and my Nan Nan
Where would you say was a special place for you?
I liked being at home.
What’s your earliest memory a child?
I remember being at Skegness, you know, between Skegness and Ingoldmells. My Grandad and Nan Nan used to take me and my cousin, Donna on holiday. My mum had me very young so in some ways my Nan Nan was like a Mum to me.
I remember being only little and walking with my Nan Nan. I can remember I was just old enough where they would let me run on ahead. I was allowed to let go of her hand and run. I wanted to run and run and run. It felt so free. I also remember my Grandad. He would sit me on the wall. Then he would stand there, hands behind his back and whistle and we would look at the sea together.
What is your favourite food?
Spaghetti Bolognaise
What do you do for fun, hobbies, having a laugh?
I like chillin’ with friends and doing things with the kids. The kids are very important!
What is your favourite time of day?
The evening. I love it: getting’ all sorted for the next day and I can have relaxing, fun time with the kids before they get ready for bed. It’s the best part of the day.
If you could change one thing about yourself, what would it be?
Well I have made some progress in that department. I used to crave things. I would see something like clothes and I would just have to have it. If I had some money I would be working out how I could buy that thing I had just seen. But I don’t care about things like that no more.
How would you describe your life a couple of years ago?
‘Being Judged.’ It felt like through my life with David someone put the spotlight on me – I was being watched all the time.
How did you see yourself?
I made a decision in my life to fit in with David’s. So we became this family that was like out in front, but at the same time felt judged by everyone… by family, by friends, by police…. Whatever they thought, it’s not who we really were. I felt I was being judged all the time by everybody. I felt like people were just waiting for me to slip up. David felt like that too. I felt like I was on parade. It felt like our little family was in this bubble.There was a fight on the inside: part of us really wanted to get out of the situation but we had to maintain this bubble. People said afterwards that they thought I wasn’t approachable, they were intimidated by me. It became a vicious circle and I thought:
“Well this is just how it is; I keep up an appearance and people keep judging me”.
I had become two different people. I had the image of myself as I really wanted to be like when I was at home, just with my family, not trying to impress anyone and then I had the way I was supposed to be because of who people thought we were.
I did have the material lifestyle and all that stuff. Materially I had everything. But at the same time, I was lost. I didn’t even know myself. I would sit at home, look at all the material stuff and I wasn’t bothered. It wasn’t ‘it’ if you know what I mean.
When have you felt powerless in your life?
Lester’s death and David’s conviction.
Lyndsey appears in the Sheffield Star after David’s conviction
Lester Divers was David’s half-brother. He was killed in what the judge described as a ‘gang-land style execution’ in Freedom Road, Walkley on New Years day 2003. When he died it had a big impact on David.
I know a few years ago Lester’s death had a big impact on you and David
Lester was like a father figure. It was like losing a dad. Not many people knew. He was the one who sorted arguments who tried to help you see the value of others. He was the one who encouraged us to do the ‘right thing’ and I think he was trying to get us on the ‘right path’.
After Lester died, David and me, with 2 kids knew we wanted to get out of this life we were in. I think some people realised David was not exactly what they thought. People saw him cry. He started to pray when he visited Lester’s grave. We began to talk about what we really wanted – what was important to us.
Then when David was convicted, there was nothing I could do. I thought to myself, “It’s just me and the boys, and somehow I have to build a new life.” – It’s the scariest thing, and I had never been alone like this before. I just didn’t know what to do next, what to say to the boys.
Actually I had a gut feeling like I knew something like this was going to happen. Before David’s conviction I started having little dreams, frightening dreams about losing David. I think God was warning me, and I even talked to David about it.
I had a feeling it was all going to go wrong. Actually it felt like that there was this dark, evil shadow creeping up on us, and just as we were trying to break out and change our lives this evil thing, ‘It’, got us. David was arrested and then convicted. It’s even like this evil shadow is trying to take hold of my kids and lead them off in the wrong direction, the wrong path. It’s not like I am fighting against another person, it’s like I am fighting against some kind of evil force. I know now with God I can say No to that. No Way!
What about the God thing. Where does that fit in?
You know when I was younger I had faith in God. I trusted him, I prayed and I knew he was there. Then as I got older, I went to him, but only in times of need, I knew he was the only person I could really trust but it was all in secret. Then the more I got into this lifestyle with David of being ‘somebody’ didn’t have time for anything else, at the same time I was losing my identity. I was becoming someone that I wasn’t.
David was the same. It felt like all eyes were on you. At the same time I always had this feeling that ‘its wrong’ the way we were living and all that. I was confused. Lester dying made us re-think. The kids were more important. Was this really the life we wanted for ourselves? It felt like even when you tried to take a different direction its like there were devils, you know some evil plan so that even friends were directing us, trying to stop us from breaking out to becoming who we wanted to be.
We started to feel like we were heading in the right direction last year. David was spending a lot more time at home, he hardly went out anywhere for over a year. I got a job, my dad helped me set up a little beauty shop in Walkley but at the same time I started to have the dreams. They were bad dreams about David being taken…
We don’t think God did this to us, the other way around. People have been surprised but I believe something like this needed to happen to give us a chance at the life change we really wanted. And the funny thing is, even though David is in prison at the moment, he now feels more free than ever.
I think when something bad happens in people’s lives, the majority turn to God for help.
What would you like to be remembered for?
I want to try and help people. I love kids and want to make sure my boys stay on the right path now, whatever it takes. I would like to help others know there is another choice away from the ‘gangster’ lifestyle.
Can you tell someone how they can connect with God, like you have?
Well I had some things that were important to me, but I just ignored them. My Nan Nan is a believer and taught me to pray when I was younger. I went to a Church of England school and that had an effect. But then I just ignored it because of the pressure to be what people expected of me. Now I think I believe in myself more too. I want to do what I believe and not worry about what others think. I had a gut feeling all along saying“This is the right way.” I would say to others BELIEVE in yourself, in what you really want. That’s how I came back to God, because deep down it’s what I really wanted.
Who are you really, then Lyndsey?
When I was younger I knew what I believed and was quite a strong person. I could deal with difficult things. I believed in God and I could trust him. Then my choices and the things we got into, I think I lost all that and I lost myself. When David was convicted it was a huge deal. But I also knew I had to make some choices. I started to believe in God again. I started to find myself again. I felt like I had left God out of my life, I had said to him that I didn’t need him anymore. The ONE person who could help. So I came back to Him because there is no-one else who made me feel better inside. I know it’s not money. I know it’s not the respect I used to get which I thought was important.
I am standing here now, I know we’re not there yet, but through faith in God as a loving father, through believing I just know we will get there. I would say to everyone “Have faith in God”.
What are your favourite bits in the bible?
I like the story Jesus tells about sowing seed. It tells about how you can let this seed, God’s words, speak into your life and it will grow and produce really good things, if you only let it. I like when it talks about being born again, like having a new start, that’s what we needed, that’s what we have got.
I don’t read the Bible like all the time, but things will happen and I think to myself, “I bet there is something in there to help me”. So I pick it up and read and it’s like there is a reflection. The one thing that is happening to you right then is being talked about in the bible. Wow. So it gives you hope and direction. It’s good that!
How do you pray?
Well, I am still learning to pray. I pray in the morning. I always pray for the kids and their day. I even try to teach them the power of prayer when they don’t know what to do. When I hear good news I give thanks. When I hear bad news I pray.
This is just the beginning. I believe it will eventually all work out for good. Wait and see.Watch this space!
